Northeast Regional "Engine Lost Power"

Sounds like a easy to tell, easy to understand story.  There's no collision detection system on a locomotive I'm aware of.

More likely the time was needed to inspect the locomotive for any damage, maybe remove some carcass stuck on the front, although a deer would be little more than a "splat" stain on the locomotive.

Rusty

Being on the N.E. Corridor could there have been an electrical current loss if it was an electric engine ?

If I strike something that has some sort of effect on the operational status of the engine we have to talk to mechanical and dispatcher,probably inspect then get back with both mechanical and dispatch again.

But usually a deer has no effect on the engine unless like Rusty mentioned it’s hung up somewhere.

mackb4 posted:

Being on the N.E. Corridor could there have been an electrical current loss if it was an electric engine ?

Except the Amtrak Northeast Corridor is NOT outside 3rd rail, mounted at ground level. The electrical power for all equipment is from overhead wires, so "hitting a dear" shouldn't have affected electrical power to the locomotive of powered rail car. 

If I strike something that has some sort of effect on the operational status of the engine we have to talk to mechanical and dispatcher,probably inspect then get back with both mechanical and dispatch again.

But usually a deer has no effect on the engine unless like Rusty mentioned it’s hung up somewhere.

There is always the possibility that the dear disrupted/disturbed one or both of the HEP cables and/or connections on the front, which even if not cutting off the HEP, would still have to be inspected.

mackb4 posted:

Being on the N.E. Corridor could there have been an electrical current loss if it was an electric engine ?

If I strike something that has some sort of effect on the operational status of the engine we have to talk to mechanical and dispatcher,probably inspect then get back with both mechanical and dispatch again.

But usually a deer has no effect on the engine unless like Rusty mentioned it’s hung up somewhere.

Thank you for your very informed response!

Clearly,   you have experienced this sort of occurance and speak from your  Personal Experience.

Thank you for your replies. 

I was just wondering because the conductor was pretty chatty, explaining that we hit a deer, that this happens now and then, procedures, etc.   But as Hotwater said, I was thinking as well that  ""hitting a dear" shouldn't have affected electrical power to the locomotive".  Maybe in the process of checking everything the HEP cables needed to be checked or whatnot and thus the power from the locomotive to the cars had to be disconnected, hence the saying of lost power, IDK.  it was night, so the lights were down except just a few lights anyway, so hard to tell what power we lost (I am assuming there is some type of battery backup for some lighting  in the cars), I think the hvac sounds were out for a bit. 

Regarding the "lost power to the engine" comment, I am going to chalk it up to imprecise language by the guy on the intercom, since I am probably one guy out of all the people on a thousand trains that would have thought twice about it.  

Not trying to make this sound in anyway like some type of big inconvenience or story at all, I am just unusually interested in trains including minutiae (some of you might relate), and don't know much about modern trains.

This topic reminded me of an experience we had way back in 1981. We were on Amtrak's Southwest Chief climbing the heavy grade to Raton Pass when the train, already running slow, began to slow even more until I wondered if we were stopping. Suddenly all the house power in the train shut off and we began to slowly pick up a little speed. The power came back on as we were going through the tunnel at the summit of the grade. The engineer had shut off house power in order to have all the power for traction.

Lew

Maybe the engineman put the train into emergency trying  to avoid the deer?? Recovered the air , crew inspected the train and away we go again.

Gregg posted:

Maybe the engineman put the train into emergency trying  to avoid the deer??

One would think that the original poster would have mentioned that the train made a VERY ABRUPT stop, if the Engineer had placed the brake valve in emergency.

Recovered the air , crew inspected the train and away we go again.

The only time this happened to me was also on the North East Corridor in CT, all the conductor told us was "the choo-choo is broken".

Hot Water posted:

Gregg posted:

Maybe the engineman put the train into emergency trying  to avoid the deer??

One would think that the original poster would have mentioned that the train made a VERY ABRUPT stop, if the Engineer had placed the brake valve in emergency.

Recovered the air , crew inspected the train and away we go again.

 

Not abrupt at all.  Smooth or smoother than a station stop. 

john in western pa posted:

mackb4 posted:

Being on the N.E. Corridor could there have been an electrical current loss if it was an electric engine ?

If I strike something that has some sort of effect on the operational status of the engine we have to talk to mechanical and dispatcher,probably inspect then get back with both mechanical and dispatch again.

But usually a deer has no effect on the engine unless like Rusty mentioned it’s hung up somewhere.

Thank you for your very informed response!

Clearly,   you have experienced this sort of occurance and speak from your  Personal Experience.

My experience is 28 years with diesels .

Just hope I can help with the knowledge I do have though.

The industry keeps changing on me quickly as I get older 🥺 . But your most certainly welcome 🙂

I used to ride the Auto-Train frequently, and had a scnaner with me.  I once heard the engineer report to the conductor that "We just killed Bambi."  Train did not slow.

Another time the conductor put the train into emergency when she couldn't raise the engineer on the radio.  While the bedroom doors slid closed, I would not call the stop uncomfortable.  Of course, I was sitting, not standing.

I would describe an emergency brake application as "abrupt, but smooth".   After all, the engineer doesn't want people flying down the isles.

There is a video I have seen of a Cumbres & Toltec train striking a herd of cattle.  One gets dragged under the pilot (who misnamed it a cowcatcher?).  I'm glad I wasn't there to see the results.

Kent Loudon posted:

I would describe an emergency brake application as "abrupt, but smooth".   After all, the engineer doesn't want people flying down the isles.

Well, when placing the brake valve into emergency, that is EXACTLY what will happen to anyone standing or walking in the isles!

Hot Water posted:

Kent Loudon posted:

I would describe an emergency brake application as "abrupt, but smooth".   After all, the engineer doesn't want people flying down the isles.

Well, when placing the brake valve into emergency, that is EXACTLY what will happen to anyone standing or walking in the isles!

 

I would assume emergency is a dumping of the air as quickly as possible, and any "but smooth" characteristic is just an inevitable consequence of the physics of stopping a speeding train, and that people flying down the aisles is preferable to other potential consequences when a train is put into emergency braking.  

Hot Water posted:

Kent Loudon posted:

I would describe an emergency brake application as "abrupt, but smooth".   After all, the engineer doesn't want people flying down the isles.

Well, when placing the brake valve into emergency, that is EXACTLY what will happen to anyone standing or walking in the isles!

 

No they won't! Not as long as they don't derail or hit anything to cause an abrupt stop or they are on the cab on the back end of a hundred car empty hopper train going very slow when the brakes apply. Actually, the faster you are going the smoother the stop.
Sure, it is a more rapid stop and if standing you will want to hold on to something, especially the closer you get to the actual stop. But, as for throwing people through the air, that's a bunch of Hollywood!

I found it odd one time that after hitting a tree across the tracks at maybe twenty mph that the unit after going again didn't load properly. There was a lot of snow on the ground and it we only hit the tree fast enough to shove it out of the way instead of shattering it as we were slowing to a stop. But, the unit wouldn't pull much after that and we had to go back to the house to get another one that would work.

Big Jim posted:

Hot Water posted:

Kent Loudon posted:

I would describe an emergency brake application as "abrupt, but smooth".   After all, the engineer doesn't want people flying down the isles.

Well, when placing the brake valve into emergency, that is EXACTLY what will happen to anyone standing or walking in the isles!

 

No they won't! Not as long as they don't derail or hit anything to cause an abrupt stop or they are on the cab on the back end of a hundred car empty hopper train going very slow when the brakes apply. Actually, the faster you are going the smoother the stop.
Sure, it is a more rapid stop and if standing you will want to hold on to something, especially the closer you get to the actual stop. But, as for throwing people through the air, that's a bunch of Hollywood!

So, how many passenger trains have you been riding, especially at 100+ MPH on the Northeast Corridor, that have gone into emergency?

Hot Water posted:

Big Jim posted:

Hot Water posted:

Kent Loudon posted:

I would describe an emergency brake application as "abrupt, but smooth".   After all, the engineer doesn't want people flying down the isles.

Well, when placing the brake valve into emergency, that is EXACTLY what will happen to anyone standing or walking in the isles!

 

No they won't! Not as long as they don't derail or hit anything to cause an abrupt stop or they are on the cab on the back end of a hundred car empty hopper train going very slow when the brakes apply. Actually, the faster you are going the smoother the stop.
Sure, it is a more rapid stop and if standing you will want to hold on to something, especially the closer you get to the actual stop. But, as for throwing people through the air, that's a bunch of Hollywood!

So, how many passenger trains have you been riding, especially at 100+ MPH on the Northeast Corridor, that have gone into emergency?

 So why do you want to argue all the time? Isn't there a post at the top of this section about being nice to everyone... let it go old man. 

Hot Water posted:

So, how many passenger trains have you been riding, especially at 100+ MPH on the Northeast Corridor, that have gone into emergency?

Probably, as many as you have! 

Big Jim posted:

Hot Water posted:

So, how many passenger trains have you been riding, especially at 100+ MPH on the Northeast Corridor, that have gone into emergency?

Probably, as many as you have! 

I doubt that. I was involved with the delivery of the EMD AEM7 units, and we did a LOT of testing on the Northeast Corridor, both with passengers in the trains and without. 

How long did the testing go on? A week? month? Years?    Don't forget,real railroaders  run across this type of thing.... emergency brake applications whether deliberate or not  almost daily .  

I completely agree  with JIM re:

No they won't! Not as long as they don't derail or hit anything to cause an abrupt stop or they are on the cab on the back end of a hundred car empty hopper train going very slow when the brakes apply. Actually, the faster you are going the smoother the stop.
Sure, it is a more rapid stop and if standing you will want to hold on to something, especially the closer you get to the actual stop. But, as for throwing people through the air, that's a bunch of Hollywood!

Hot water must be bald....he LOVES splitting hairs....Jack, are trying to establish a pecking order on every Real Trains subject?

redjimmy1955 posted:

Hot water must be bald....he LOVES splitting hairs....Jack, are trying to establish a pecking order on every Real Trains subject?

No. I simply have a hard time understanding comments from those "experts" that have no experience with operations on the Northeast Corridor, especially emergency brake applications, at speeds over 100 MPH.

Hot Water posted:

Big Jim posted:

Hot Water posted:

So, how many passenger trains have you been riding, especially at 100+ MPH on the Northeast Corridor, that have gone into emergency?

Probably, as many as you have! 

I doubt that. I was involved with the delivery of the EMD AEM7 units, and we did a LOT of testing on the Northeast Corridor, both with passengers in the trains and without. 

So, how many Crash Test Dummies did you kill?

Since the topic has strayed a little into emergency stops,Big  Jim is correct on how  fast your going .The stop is generally smoother at a faster speed,but like mentioned certain circumstances make changes in the reaction of the effect when doing so.

I’ve only been 60 mph top speed,when running a train and some how never went into emergency at that speed.

At 50 down to 10 mph I have several times . I’ve had different scenarios like busted air hose,air hose dragging on a crossing coming apart,I’ve had on four occasions the main brake pipe that runs the length of a car simply fall off do to age or what ever,but to get back ,the speed and curvature makes the difference that I’ve experienced in the ride quality if you might say,the train has when an emergency brake application occurs either by the train initiating  it or the operator.

I had 18 loaded “ECP” coal cars spread the rail once coming out of Devils Neck curve on NS’s Wayne Branch ,near the end of a 100 car train going 10 mph and I never felt it tug,lurch, nothing until it slowly started dragging my speed down until I notched out of the throttle and brought my train to a stop.

And I guess at the last minute the car ahead of the 18 derailed cars broke the knuckle and pulled the electric cable  and air hose  apart  and finally put my train in emergency .

I only had to put a passenger train into emergency once, going engine last, down grade plus a curve.  I think I had a GP-11 and about 4 passenger cars and a transfer caboose.  In that case a contractor clearing brush totally misunderstood what they were and were not allowed to do.  We passed them on the way up grade without incident.  On the way back the had a 6 to 8 inch thick tree trunk across the rails, using the track to prop it up while the chain-sawed it into smaller pieces.

Fortunately the conductor's voice on the radio kept getting more excited like a geiger counter getting hot.  I was slowing down but by the time he had a clear view I had already dumped the air.  Slow speed and brakes already applied so no injuries or flying people. 

The crew on the ground however tried to pull the log off as they heard us coming- horn attached to the caboose - and failing that jumped into the bushes, thinking the world was about to end.  Log cleared without a safety incident.  Pumped up the air and continued on.

(Contractor later reprimanded, possibly fired)

Anyway, I don't think the OP's story sounded like an emergency application was made.  Things would definitely go flying around with an emergency application at 60 to 100 mph.  Sounds like a quick inspection and off you go.

jhz563 posted:

I only had to put a passenger train into emergency once, going engine last, down grade plus a curve.  I think I had a GP-11 and about 4 passenger cars and a transfer caboose.  In that case a contractor clearing brush totally misunderstood what they were and were not allowed to do.  We passed them on the way up grade without incident.  On the way back the had a 6 to 8 inch thick tree trunk across the rails, using the track to prop it up while the chain-sawed it into smaller pieces.

Fortunately the conductor's voice on the radio kept getting more excited like a geiger counter getting hot.  I was slowing down but by the time he had a clear view I had already dumped the air.  Slow speed and brakes already applied so no injuries or flying people. 

The crew on the ground however tried to pull the log off as they heard us coming- horn attached to the caboose - and failing that jumped into the bushes, thinking the world was about to end.  Log cleared without a safety incident.  Pumped up the air and continued on.

(Contractor later reprimanded, possibly fired)

I remember those brush cutters, they weren’t overly swift.  I think SWP had an incident or two with them as well...

According to Hot Air...er, Water,🤔 none of your ACTUAL experience matches his expertise....rflmao.  That said, all this info from y'all is great to know...and thanks for POSTING! 

Kent Loudon posted:

I would describe an emergency brake application as "abrupt, but smooth".   After all, the engineer doesn't want people flying down the isles.

There is a video I have seen of a Cumbres & Toltec train striking a herd of cattle.  One gets dragged under the pilot (who misnamed it a cowcatcher?).  I'm glad I wasn't there to see the results.

Now that was one way to make hamburger.Problem there was no french fries.

>>Now that was one way to make hamburger.

But those ballast chunks are hard to chew!