Repairing Post-War Lionel Couplers

Turn the car upside down.

Check out Joe's homemade tool for riveting:

Joe Geiser posted:

Hi,

There has been interest in some of tools I use for repairing Lionel trains and accessories so I’d like to share what makes my repairs a little easier. The first two pics are of a hand held small rivet and eyelet press that costs less than $10.00. This tool works great on knuckle couplers, switch repair and replacing the carbon rollers pickups for ZW and KW transformers. You can repair all four rollers w/o taking the assembly apart, takes about 15-20 minutes. Anywhere you need to press small rivets or eyelets, even in close quarters, you can use this easy to make tool.

An inexpensive pair of needle nose vise grips drilled and tapped for 2 4-40 cap screws as shown in the pic, and a couple of locking nuts. Peen over the rivets that hold the vise grips together to tighten the action, this will center the clincher with the anvil. Grind the top screw to a soft round tip as shown, grind the bottom head of the screw till its flat with a small depression in the middle to hold the head of the rivet. Size the jaws to the rivet by holding it between the clincher and anvil and adjusting the jaw gap until you can lock it while gently holding the rivet in place, remove rivet and slightly close the gap, this way it will flare the rivet and lock it in place.

I will admit that a HH or Lionel arbor press does a neater job, but for those of us who don’t have hundreds of dollars to invest my press is an affordable alternative. I have used this hundreds of times and never had a rivet back out on me.

 

If it's a postwar factory rivet, I have been able to pinch the bottom end enough to get it out complete and reuse it. Often, the original rivets were just clinched with a small side cutting plier so the end distorted enough so the rivet could not come out of the hole. I think the hobby has over thought the riveting process for coupler knuckles and carbon rollers in ZW's BTW.

Superb posts, Rob.  Bookmarked this for future use.

Thanks Rob,

I'll lightly clamp the car upside down (luckily it's a gondola car) and try again. I tried upside down earlier but was also trying to balance the car in my hands; not enough fingers.

For the punch I'll try an automatic (spring-loaded) centerpunch. If that doesn't spread the rivet I'll resort to a punch & hammer but will need to support the top of the rivet in either case.

Roger

Oh yes, thanks for Joe's homemade riveting tool description. If I get ambitious I'll give it a try.

Roger

I have heard of people using a small piece of nylon fishing line threaded thru the components, then pulled out after riveting,  That way you don't loose the spring...]

Marty

Do the work by holding everything inside a clear plastic bag. If a part goes flying, it will be captured by the bag.

Fishing line...plastic bag...both great ideas! If I had done either of these I wouldn't have lost a spring yesterday.

Thanks for your replies and ideas! What a fantastic forum!

Roger

When you get mad enough.......... Super glue!

I think the hobby has over thought the riveting process for coupler knuckles and carbon rollers in ZW's BTW.

I don't think it matters what a ZW carbon roller rivet's clinch looks like, but for a piece of rolling stock its nice to have the knuckle rivet clinch look neat.

TIP: the black knuckle rivets are made of a material that is softer than the shiny rivets, they clinch much easier.  Maybe its brass versus steel.

A little dab of teflon grease to rest the spring on holds it, push the rive in just enough to engauge the spring and then slide knuckle over an in. A light tap on rivet with a splayed punch and small ball peen hammer--viola!

Yeah, teflon grease to hold the spring in place...I like that!

Thanks for another great idea!

SUCCESS!!! It took me all of 5 minutes to install the spring, knuckle, and new rivet once I gathered everything together. The two smoking guns for me were: 1. Have the knuckle upside down, and 2. Use a dab of grease to hold things together while I manipulate all the pieces into position.

Now that I completed the repair I'm finding other threads talking about the same subject so thanks to all for your patience and willingness to help a fellow enthusiast!

Roger Lee

I use the Brakeman's Rivet Tool Set, knocks them out very quickly.  I didn't buy the large blocks for special stuff like the F-3 fitted base place, just the stuff for riveting common parts.

I too initially struggled replacing springs, but I ended up with a technique and a tool that works well for me .. less than $10 in tools to modify

• I took a 1” C-Clamp and removed the floating anvil off the top of the threaded screw.
• Then took the screw and handle and put in in my drill press and drilled a hole in the top of the screw where the anvil was.
• Make sure that the hole is as close as possible to the center of the screw or it will give your grief later.
• The hole was near the same diameter as an O-Gage Tubular Track Pin.
• I then pressed the O-Gage Tubular Track pin into the end of the screw and re-installed it in the clamp.
• I drill of the end of the existing rivet carefully with a small diameter drill bit and push the old rivet out.
• I push the new rivet in place and use the C-Clamp with the bullet end of the O-gage Tubular Track Pin into the recess at the bottom of the rivet.
• The bullet end of the 0-Gage Tubular Track pin sits nicely in the rivet pocket
• I rotate the clamp just enough to upset the end of the rivet and done.
• Spring Replacement.. I put the new rivet thru the spring and the removed coupler end.
• I put it roughly in place and then use the small screwdriver shown above to push the end of the spring in place into the coupler mounted to the car.
• The notch in the end of the small screwdriver makes controlling the spring end simple
• When the spring is in the right spot, I pull the rivet out, push the removed coupler part in place and push the pin back into place
• Then upset the rivet .. I replace a spring in less than 10-minutes