Skip to main content

Does your newer, more lightweight locomotive inexplicably derail, especially around tighter curves?  It could be torque steer!  

For the uninitiated, torque steer pertains to front wheel drive vehicles...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_steer

Torque steer is the unintended influence of engine torque on the steering, especially in front-wheel drive vehicles. For example, during heavy acceleration the steering may pull to one side, which may be disturbing to the driver.

Torque steer can also be manifested on newer, lighter diesel and electric locos having a) only the front truck driven and b) traction tires on the same axle.  I've personally experienced this on my Lionel Amtrak Alco FAs, and, more recently, on my A-B-A RMT Beef lashup.  

Same axle traction tire issues are nothing new, of course; the problems of differential steering with neither wheel slipping on curves have been documented in the past.  However,  I've found the problem to be exacerbated when the power truck in question is the lead truck. 

Fortunately, there IS a quick and dirty fix:  Turn the loco around and run it with the powered truck in the back!  Like magic, the problem disappears.   

In the case of my Lionel Alcos, I wound up rebuilding the locos with the powered truck in the rear.  Since the front and back trucks are built slightly differently, this entailed disassembling both trucks and putting the power components in the rear trucks.  

Since, for some odd reason, the rear A unit of my A-B-A Beef lashup was not equipped with a working headlamp, I'll have to install one.  Minor edit.    I'll also probably wind up rewiring the motors to start in default "reverse".  

Have any of you experienced this issue?  If so, tell us how you dealt with it! 

Mitch 

Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Some may remember my topic on a similar topic, Improving the Lionel Phantom Locomotive.  IMO, having only one drive motor and putting it on the front truck is one of the more stupid configurations I've seen!  Most of the locomotives I've run across with this configuration had trouble pulling more than a couple of cars, the Phantom was a case in point.  Moving the motor to the rear is a definite improvement, having two motors really makes a difference.   In the case of the Phantom, I can't imagine what possessed Lionel to do that, obviously there was plenty of room for the motor on the rear truck.  As Mitch has pointed out, having a motor on the rear of some other models shouldn't have been a challenge for Lionel either.

Mitch, put another motor in those, you'll be amazed how well they run!

Having run into the identical issue with my new/old K-Line Alcos, I've acquired a bit of insight into the matter:

GEDC2336

As you will note, the traction tires are mounted inboard.  Now, I can see this making sense from an engineering standpoint, transferring maximum tractive effort to the rearward wheels, but the Laws of Unintended Consequences will not be denied.  What is actually happening in this case is something not unlike this:

In the case of the Alco, the front wheels are lifting just enough for the flanges to clear the rails, and, first curve you come to...well.

Since the traction tires are inboard on both trucks, you get the same result regardless of engine direction. 

A further bit of empirical experimentation shows that, if you run the dummy loco first, this tames the problem, but I'm going to be wanting to address this issue on a more permanent basis....

(To be continued.  Onwards to the la-bor-a-tory!)

Mitch

Attachments

Images (1)
  • GEDC2336

Add Reply

Post
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×
×