Who’s happy with CSX" #1776 Veterans /Lionel Failed Spectacularly on this Veterans camo paint job.

Lionel has made it clear by their Actions that they don't care & even more so now that they have no competition.   Fool me once..........

Thumbs up for posting Actual photos, I was fearing that this was going to be another N&W J thread where we have to imagine different shades of red or maroon.

Wow, that’s pretty lackluster. What a shame especially for that kind of investment. The yellow is wrong as well, in addition to the botched camo paint.

Thanks for sharing, I have one on order and hope to have this week. Your right the CAMO is very understated and from your photo almost looks non existent.

Yes agree very lackluster.  Got mine in on Friday and it even looks like no CAMO on it.  Seems like everything just blends in.  It is a good running engine, but don’t like the siren for the last of the five whistles.  Just doesn’t work for this engine.

@SPSF posted:

Lionel has made it clear by their Actions that they don't care & even more so now that they have no competition.

No. They've been messing up their colors on a variety of paints on a regular basis for at least the past 5-6 years, although it's seemed worse in the past several, well before the MTH announcement. For some reason, there appears to be a disconnect occurring between Lionel and their Chinese producers as to the use of correct paint colors.

Send it back, don't take delivery of shoddy work

Dave

Looks like the colors are too pale. Does anyone have photos of csx 911?

How can you let this go through  production? Has anybody ever called up Lionel customer service and complained about a disappointing paint job?

Send it back

I called Lionel's customer service for another poor quality complaint but they sent me to their email system. They said the reason why they wanted me to email them instead of going through them on the phone was because they wanted my complaint to be able to reach the "higher ups." This happened about a month ago and I still have not heard a word from them.

Maybe there is to much camo you just can't see it! Sorry I just had to.

@Zigmont posted:

Lionel 2033629 - Legacy ES44AC Diesel Locomotive "CSX" #1776 Veterans

Who’s happy with 1776? Lionel didn’t presented this engine very well! I think that Lionel Failed Spectacularly on this Veterans camo paint job. (Photo 2)  The camouflage in the  Catalog (photo1 ) is not the camouflage in my photo. it appears as it didn’t get all of the colors to make on my shell to make it prop. It's Dull with no luster and like an invisible pixelated look. No lighter beige colors  darker colors combination of colors and patterns typical of camouflage and looks nothing like the real veterans model in (photo 3). Mad as **** spending 500.00 on this engine.

These engines  are the most advance realistic  trains I every bought. The engine has amazing  details other than the paint job and the 5 horm /bell sound options, the sounds are amazing, LED light are bright, the automatic sequence is great. I bought the same model ES44Ac 3194 For Horning Law Enforcement and its paint job is amazing.

Not only that the rear of the unit is missing the art work on the rear of the radiator cover. I thought Lionel was working with CSX to get these paint jobs right? It seems the colors have been off for years. Lionel is making leaps and bounds with technology, but can’t get color schemes right? I’m going to stop pre ordering until they get the colors right. If the colors are correct at my LHS I’ll buy it.

Here is the CSX Law enforcement 3194

@Zigmont posted:

How can you let this go through  production? Has anybody ever called up Lionel customer service and complained about a disappointing paint job?

LAst year when Lionel issued the N&W J steam engine the color was off.  Well 95 customers got Lionel to re-paint the engines. This work was outsourced to Harry Hieke who did a good job. I visited Harry earlier in the year, Pre-COVID, and saw several of the engine in various stages and his work was a vast improvement. Also one of my train buddies had his "J" included in that work and opted for the weathering, which he paid for, and its really spot on.

As for the CAMO paint job I'll wait until I get mine hopefully this week

Zigmont, hope this helps

I got CSX 3194 this week, so far very happy with all the new features they added on. Including new prime mover sounds and very realistic radio chatter sounds. But it appears there are a few kinks they didn't quite work out for the production run.

For starters, it appears that rule 17 function is not present for the front headlight (bright all the time). Rear headlight still has the Rule 17 function, but the front one has it omitted for whatever reason.

I am surprised to see they brought back the sleep function from previous ES44 models. But I have noticed that the smoke unit does not turn itself back on if you wake up the engine on your own, and not let it go through the entire sleep mode cycle. It does reactivate the smoke unit when it finishes the sleep cycle on its own. Anyone else have somewhat minor issue this on theirs?

Other than these issues, I am very happy with how they did this run of the ES44. Lots of new features that are welcome in my book and that make this version a lot more fun to operate, compared to previous runs.

@breezinup posted:

No. They've been messing up their colors on a variety of paints on a regular basis for at least the past 5-6 years, although it's seemed worse in the past several, well before the MTH announcement. For some reason, there appears to be a disconnect occurring between Lionel and their Chinese producers as to the use of correct paint colors.

So will the lack of competition make it more or less likely they will do a better job?  Or is your point that they didn't care then so it's really just a case of ongoing incompetence?

I don't want to argue with you, but someone spends 500-600 dollars on a toy locomotive, maybe more, and is not happy with the paint job, it's not really your job to correct him or the other posters in the thread since it is pretty clear the photos of the product don't match the illustration.

This is why I stopped pre-ordering. When the Vision Challengers showed up with light grey smokeboxes, I cancelled my order.

Now I wait to see and hear an engine on YouTube or here on this forum before I buy

@SPSF posted:

Lionel has made it clear by their Actions that they don't care & even more so now that they have no competition.   Fool me once..........

I agree that this product as delivered does not match up to the planned one.

"Quality" in a manufacturing environment is about (a) repeatability, and (b) matching the design.  MacDonald's IS an example of quality- a Big Mac all over the World matches the design ("two all beef patties, special sauce...), whether or not you think it is a good hamburger.

The right paint scheme costs pretty much the same as a wrong one.  The lead time from design and specification is far more than a year, so now is WAY too soon after the MTH announcement for Lionel to have made any conscious decisions because of a lack of competition.

I would say this is another example of what a company deals with when the manufacturing process is remote from the design process. It might be that it missed a single pass through the paint line.  I think this is a problem of execution,  not design or intent.

There is no easy solution, because of the small size of the market.  The importer cannot afford to station a QC guy in China empowered to stop production when the first engine comes off the line.  They have to trust the manufacturer to deliver what was specified.

And it is also unlikely that a "build it in the USA" plan is practical. And- back when they DID manufacture in the USA, they had a far simpler and less technically sophisticated product.  It was pretty easy to get perfect paint when everything was black.

So- this is reality I am afraid.

Except in very rare instances, this thread illustrates why I don't pre-order anything anymore.  I went through the F40PH and H10 fiascos, and I don't intend to let them have another bite at the apple!  I'm just glad I dodged the Mogul disaster.  I did later buy a Mogul NIB for less than half the MSRP and fixed it myself.

I have enough stuff to last a lifetime, so if I miss out on one or two items, I can live with it.  I want to see them before I buy them nowadays.

The only issue with the "wait and see" approach is that you then miss out on the pre-order discount and typically end up paying more for the product than someone who pre-ordered and I'm not fond of paying more for something than other people have.

Luckily, I live w/in a half hour of a large dealer, so I pre-order to get the best price and they call me when it's in and I go down to pick it up. I have them unpack it and I inspect for correct paint, defects, broken or missing parts and have them run it on their test track to make sure it runs and smokes properly. If the product fails any of those inspections, I ask them to re-box it and get me another one from the back and go through the same procedure and, hopefully, the next one is ok. We once went through three units before finding one that was right and I appreciate their time and efforts and buy a lot of product from them.

Even if you don't live near an LHS and have to have an engine shipped, you can still ask the dealer to call you after it arrives and before shipping and have them check the product for defects and broken pieces and run it on their test track before shipping it to you and most will be happy to do so.

And my CSX  Veterans #1776 engine has been stuck in USPS Philadelphia Hub since December 3, 2020. It is now December 9, 2020.  Maybe it will never arrive.

They could have laid down the colors in the wrong order, overprinting colors that were meant to show through.

It looks like the time has arrived to boycott Lionel, cancel all ordered products and return incorrect models, demanding a full refund at the same time.

One thing has to be said about Mark, The Menards Train Guy, he goes far above and beyond his responsibility to make it right when it isn't or will provide the "why" when a boo boo was made.  Looks like Lionel has missed the train altogether and Big Time at that!

Thanks Mark

@biscuitag97 posted:

Looks like the colors are too pale. Does anyone have photos of csx 911?

Original poster 3rd pic

I don't even like that one. ( and I'm a retired Veteran)

Doesn't the factory send a production sample for approval before starting the run?

I wonder if Lionel approved a sample with this paint job, or if the production run deviated from the sample but Lionel decided to pass them along to the customer regardless.

Just reinforces my resolve to Never Preorder Anything.

My Lionel 2033620 arrived after a delay.  It needed all four sanding pipes on the engineer side glued back to the truck side frames.

The front MU cable was loose and a red MU cable socket was loose in the box.  I had to re-install the red socket, the expand the MU hose to fit in place on the front.

A truck gear box screw was loose in the box and all of the truck gear box screws needed to be tightened, some several turns. I lubricated the engine and will test it after dinner.

There are a few paint scrapes, but they are minor.  I will have to touch up the white hand rail because the vertical posts exposed brass railing when I positioned them vertically, uncovering some unpainted railing.

Yes, the Camouflage Paint is very faint and does not stand out very well.  It would look weathered if the bold blue paint on the nose of the engine did not look like fresh paint.

The American flags are nice, but I can't be certain there is an engineer inside the cab yet.  When I get it on the track, the crew will probably show through the windshield.

At least this ES44AC has all the parts.  My 2033530 Blue CSX 3010 was missing a front left bottom step and had a rear left step glued at an incline, not parallel to the other steps.  Both MU hoses were loose in the box.  There was also a loose truck gear box screw bouncing around during transit.

Depending on how it runs, I will keep this engine.  Listen to the five different horns that are accessed by AUX 1 Key on the Legacy 990 Remote.  I will keep this engine.

Sincerely, John Rowlen