Early reviews seem underwhelmed with Spanish architect, Santiago Calatrava's $4.B design. A few images for your viewing pleasure...
Any thoughts?
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Ugly, outrageously costly to maintain, outrageously costly to construct, impractical hard to transfer from one subway line to the other. Another example of total waste of taxpayers money.
"Total waste of taxpayer's money"? Absolutely not! I'm sure it went into all the "right" pockets.
Ok, wild design. But do recall that it is 2016, not 1916 - - not every public building needs to look like the Acropolis.
Architecture appropriate to both time and place - a carcass picked clean.
Form should follow function. Where is Louis Sullivan when ya really need him?
Hard to miss it. Looks like a giant moth. It is a shocking contrast to everything around it. It does not blend in. Not sure if that's good or bad. And yes, it does look expensive.
I suspect the reaction will be similar to I.M. Pei's glass pyramid at the Louvre. It will take some getting used to (years).
Almost anywhere else in this country, you could probably have gotten it done for half the price.
Photos don't do the scale of this thing justice.
I saw this in September on my visit to the site of the WTC. I didn't even know what the heck it was at the time.
NYC, more than any other city I've ever been to, is a mixture of so many different ideas, just about anything 'works' there, regardless how you like it or not.
The "fish-bone wings" seem pretentious. It's saying, "look at me, see how different I am". All for show, not function. Ugh.
What hope is there in maintaining all these lovely white finishes?
Opulence, I has it... Hope it comes with a scrub brush.
I've changed my mind. It looks like a well groomed porcupine.
Mill City posted:What hope is there in maintaining all these lovely white finishes?
NONE, of course. Especially at track level. I think the dirtiest thing I have ever seen inside the US other than a sewage plant or landfill is between the platforms on any underground NYC subway. The filth must be inches thick down there!
Looks like the skeletal remains of one of Godzilla's foes. Maybe Mothra?
It's future...
Jon,
Let's not confess issue here with your Picture above.
That's a Picture above is the NYC, Transit Authority.
Your other Picture is the Port of Authority of NY and NJ two different agency.
Good Luck, John
If this were a concert hall or museum then it would likely be fine for those uses. To function as a major transportation hub with many thousands of people traversing each day, it is atrocious. One of the biggest challenges of the city has always been, the efficient movement of huge crowds coming and going to and from the city every day. If in fact this structure does not make that easier then it is a huge disservice to the public.
There is a time, place and function for these architect's crazy visions, but downtown NYC at this location is definitely not the place. I don't know which city or state agencies are responsible for approving this but they ought to be run out of town on a rail.
I was born and raised and worked in and around NYC for many years, using the subways most often. Unless those floors and walls have some magical coating where they can just wash off all the crime, this is going look bad in pretty short order.
IMO it is a shame. The people of the city deserved better than this.
Ed
NYC,SUBWAY TRANSIT SIGNAL posted:Jon,
Let's not confess issue here with your Picture above.
That's a Picture above is the NYC, Transit Authority.
Your other Picture is the Port of Authority of NY and NJ two different agency.
Good Luck, John
Yes, I understand that. I chose the photo for dramatic purposes in an attempt to illustrate how difficult it will be to maintain those finishes. Certainly it caters to a different ilk, but gum will find that Carrara marble floor. Time will prove the implication of these decisions.
Ah . . . no.
I like it, reminds me of a dove. Seems appropriate given the location.
I wonder of the public sentiment was the same for Penn Station when it was designed and built?
Gotta hand it to them, the taxpayers got their 4 billion dollars worth. The outside looks downright stupid and the inside has all the warmth of a modern hospital entrance and a parking garage.
Is this the best that art and architecture in today's society has to offer?
Rule292 posted:I wonder of the public sentiment was the same for Penn Station when it was designed and built?
Lets hope we don't have to wait 53-years before it's replaced with a sports arena.
Similar comments were made about UAs Chicago terminal at Ohare. They managed to keep it clean and the underground passway lighting display still works well,
Saw pictures of this a couple of days ago on TV. Didn't hear the amount it cost but was in the billions and over runs has doubled the cost projections. It will be a mall with about 250 stores, and will only be the fifth busiest stop on the line. Have too get used to the exterior, but the interior looks very nice.
Jack
As a life long New Yorker I hate it! Waste of my tax dollars by the Port Authority of NY & NJ. The over runs were HUGE! I would have preferred a more subdued and dignified entrance but my opinion does not count. Hopefully it will be kept clean and move the commuters from the different modes of transportation efficiently.
its a spectacular tribute to the spirit of New York City, and the thousands that perished on that site.
the transportation center that lies below the occulus is far better than what was there before. it's a small miracle it was brought back to use after both towers fell into it. that the 'bathtub' foundation survived the tower's collapse.
as Vincent Scully remarked when NY Penn Station was torn down (paraphrase): 'you once entered the city like a king, now scurry in like a rat.'
a noble effort I say.
It stinks.
Rule292 posted:Gotta hand it to them, the taxpayers got their 4 billion dollars worth. The outside looks downright stupid and the inside has all the warmth of a modern hospital entrance and a parking garage.
MENTAL Hospital!
Big_Boy_4005 posted:Hard to miss it. Looks like a giant moth. It is a shocking contrast to everything around it. It does not blend in. Not sure if that's good or bad. And yes, it does look expensive.
I'm relatively open-minded about these adventurous things, but I also think there's beauty in functionality, and in structures that enhance and feel comfortable in their surroundings. This does neither. There's too much fluff in this design, most all of which is very expensive, non-functional fluff. I certainly agree it's a shocking contrast to all around it, to the point of being jarring, and it diminishes every other structure in the vicinity. It very well defines the term "over the top."
Guy's. The Port of Authority will takes care it.
In my old Day's working in New York for Thirty Eight Years. and had some experience working with the Port Of Authority on other Construction projects. I believe that they will take good care of it for future generations to come.
This is there pride and joy of 911.
Good luck guy's, John
PRR Man posted:its a spectacular tribute to the spirit of New York City, and the thousands that perished on that site.
I didn't know it was a memorial. At the risk of sounding crass, exactly how many memorials does NYC need? There's the footprints of the WTC, the museum, the first responder bronze wall, the remains of the globe over by Battery Park and I'm sure I'm missing a few others...
I found this online describing this structure, none of which I knew before reading just now:
A large transit station was not part of the 2003 Memory Foundations master plan for the site by Daniel Libeskind, which called for a smaller station along the lines of the original subterranean station that existed beneath the World Trade Center. Libeskind's design called for the Oculus space to be left open, forming a "Wedge of Light" so that sun rays around the autumnal equinox would hit the World Trade Center footprints each September. In early 2004, the Port Authority, which owns the land, modified the Libeskind plan to include a large transportation station downtown, intended to rival Penn Station and Grand Central Terminal. In a nod to the Libeskind concept, the Oculus was built to maximize the effect of the autumnal equinox rays.
I live in the New York Metropolitan area. I surprised myself that I actually like the shape of it. Maybe this is one of those designs where nobody is in the middle, either you love it or hate it.
As a New York taxpayer, I wonder who was overseeing/approving the bills on this. Unbelievable...
Tom
A TV report said that the building was supposed to depict a rising bird - a Phoenix. I suppose that may be appropriate for the World Trade Center site.
Personally, I don't care for the exterior. It looks like an alien insect to me. The interior appears to be very nice.
I always get lost trying to transfer subway lines in New York. Hopefully this new station complex makes changing from one line to another quick and easy. I think that stairs without escalators as shown in some of the photos are a mistake.
The cost overruns are universal on all large government projects that I know about. The new SF Bay Bridge was budgeted at $2 billion and finally cost just under $6 billion. I don't know why we can't get good numbers for these projects.
NH Joe
The destruction of the WTC and the loss of life there and at the Pentegon along with the passengers on the airplane that attempted to take it back from the terrorists and prevented it from crashing into the Whitehouse was one of the saddest days in the history of our country. We will also never forget all the first responders who gave their lives as well. With that being said lets go back to the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey. What is the main focus of its existence? I think it is to enhance and operate the travel and well being of the Port of NY and vicinity. The acquisition of the land and and construction of the WTC certainly did nothing for its existance. The money was wasted when it should have been used for other things. Instead of the tallest building it should have been constructed horizontally in the form of a tunnel to enhance the entry to the city for trains and trucks. If you remember it was not rentable so many. City and state agencies became tenants. After the buildings came down they had mother chance to do it again. The memorials and rememberances were done in good taste in the same vain as the Pearl Harbor memorials. The new building is very nice and we can all be proud of it. Even though the amount of money spent was to say the least was exorbident. As for the Transit Hub let us remember that the people coming in and out of the city basically only want a modern, clean, fast, reliable means of transportation. A modern utilitarian train and subway system to take the to and from their destinations. If they want to go to a museum or a grandiose edifice there are plenty of these in the area. If the transportation agencies wish to spend money why not use it on the existing systems. They are all crying poverty and fail to complete what the start out. Take for example the Second ave. subway. Their the projects are plagued with cost overruns, mistakes and corruption. The new Transit Hub reminds me of The story of the Emporers New Clothes. What a sorry joke. The Transit Flub.
Looks like I'm too late for the leg.
Nat, well said !
Let's put it to rest.
Good luck to all,John
I guess no one remember Hurricane Sandy and what it did to lower Manhattan and other locations in tri state area. A lot of damage was done to electrical and mechanical systems and flooding of the excavations. In addition what was originally planned for the whole site changed a few times. When changes occur to increase scope costs go up also time durations. Also with all the work going on in lower Manhattan labor and material prices increased due to the demand. I remember one tunnel took months longer to tunnel because of how hard the rock was. Blasting is controlled and limited due to the structures, subways, utilities and hours of work. It was not built in some farm field. Remember any time they came across remains of anything from prior buildings work stopped. In addition every year before the 9 11 anniversary no work goes on for a few days. The site was very tough due to all the conditions I stated and I am sure I left out some. I am a retired civil engineer and I was involved in a small capacity at times with work for the area.
Could it been built faster, probably yes but huge projects that involve so many governmental agencies at the City, State and Federal agencies plus private ones some times takes longer than we think should occur. There were huge fight about what would be built and how, when etc. That it is finally opening is great. I still do not like the entrance but that is what was approved by those involved.
I am expecting a troop of Romulans to exit.
Steve,
that is pretty funny. VBG
Rapid Transit Holmes posted:"Total waste of taxpayer's money"? Absolutely not! I'm sure it went into all the "right" pockets.
It did manage to create construction jobs.....
mark s posted:Ok, wild design. But do recall that it is 2016, not 1916 - - not every public building needs to look like the Acropolis.
Agreed. However, buildings need to compliment one another. My personal preference is in classical Greek architecture.
In Houston, along each of the LRT stations was made a little "different" for each local. But do the passengers actually LOOK at the items? I think not. They are trying to cath a train or bus!
However, Houston METRO did do something right. Some group wanted to build a special platform for Central Station Main. But the BOD looked at the costs of keeping it up on METRO's dime, and said, "NO!". Smart move
Maybe the concept "form follows function", as mentioned above, should have bee used in NYC.
