MTH PS3 Stalling

What engine is it that you are having problems with?

Hello

It is a Santa Fe SD-45 with Proto 3, number 30-20115-1.  I just purchased last Thursday.  I have a feeling I am over looking something but I have tried changing pieces of track, checking all the connections and just am not making progress.  I have some new Gargraves track I will try next.  Due to a move all my train stuff was packaged 8 years ago and I just am trying to set up a small layout again.  Thanks for any suggestions.

Do you have a different transformer you could test it with?

 

How about a short circle of tubular track?  

 

Have you tried any additional load (a consist of lighted cars)?

 

Can you take it back to the store, and try it there with your transformer?

 

I assume it is brand new,, and, as such, the folks at the store should be able to help you out.

I took it back to the store and it worked on their system just fine.  I ended up purchasing a new transformer and controller thinking that was the issue but no luck.  I am going to try some new Gragraves track next and see what happens.  I was wondering if the PS3 runs better with DCS perhaps.  I will post again after trying the new track.

Thanks

Made some progress.  Tried some gargraves turns and smooth as silk.  The store uses MTH Realtrax and it worked well their.  Much of the track I am using is new Fast Track so now I just need to figure out if it does not like Fast Track all together or just my Fast Track.  At least I am starting to zero in on the problem.  I will try some short sections of new Fast Track next.  This is somewhat frustrating but what a great hobby.

I use fastrack and run Ps3 engines with no issue. I have a z4000 and dcs.

Fastrack should work just fine.  Try a DCS remote commander.  They are fairly inexpensive and will allow you to run your engine in command mode.

 

Dave

I have PS-2 engines by MTH and use tubular O gauge track(Lionel style tubular, 042 curves), with an MTH Z-1000 transformer and DCS command control and everything works great.

Gargraves cause my PS-2 4-8-4 steam engine to derail at their switches, so I bought some older K-Line 042 switches a month ago and works great.

 

I have a PS-3 engine on order, an SD-70 ACe Norflok Southern heritage unit. Hope it does good as well.

 

Lee Fritz

Thanks for all the replys.  I have been thinking about DCS for quite sometime.  Got a big 50th birthday this year.  Would be a better gift than clothes.  I am going to try a few more things with the fast track and see if I can isolate the issue.

Finally figured it out.  Placed a machinist flat edge on the gargraves track and noticed the center rail on the Gargraves track is slightly higher or at least level with the outside rails.  On the fast track is slightly lower than the outside rails.  The postitive pick up on the engine is barely touching when set down on the track.  The movement in the turn must be just enough to cause a temporary break in the circuit.  The positive pick ups on my PS2 engine are longer and come down further.  Guess it will have to go back to MTH.  Glad to know what it is but sad it needs to go back.

Wow Newbie!  Are you Sherlock Holmes?

My wife says I have OCD.  It has been 8 or 9 years since I have played with the trains.  A move and kids left little time.  I wish I had joined a site like this back then.  Looking forward to learning from you all.  I see many people on here belong to clubs.  How do you find one in your area?  I am in Canton Ohio.

Thanks

OCD can come in handy. That is great detective work.

 

Before sending it back, check for anything that keeps those contact rollers from contacting the center rail. It could be a loose bolt/screw, something out of alignment, or improper assembly at the factory. Maybe a wire is too tight or pinched under the body shell. It could also be a spring that is twisted or isn't strong enough to push down.

 

Contact rollers should come down far enough to contact a center rail on all brands of track.

Thanks for everyone who has responded on this thread.  I did look to see if there was anything I could do to correct this but it just looks like a mix up in parts I think.  There is a spacer between the truck and the spring activated electrical pick up.  The pick up moves up and down properly it just is not quite low enough.  If the engine was out of warranty or I purchased used I would just shim it a little lower and buy a longer screw to screw it back on but I am afraid to alter the MTH design too much. 
The spring on the pick up is plenty strong and I could bend the assembly down a little I just am afraind to mess with it too much at this point.  I will call MTH at this point.

Thanks

I know this has been beat to death at this point, just dont want anyone to have the same issue.  I have two PS2 engines from 2006.  It is clear that the pick up assembly was changed from then to now.  This SD-45 engine was just released.  The pick up in 2006 has a much longer arm providing a little more vertical movement.  My hunch is MTH changed suppliers at one point and the design was changed. 

I would post a wanted ad on the "wanted to buy" section for the older rollers- many 2-railers have these available- they come with both 2-rail and 3-rail engines

trouble shooting is whats its all about.

I will post an add in the wanted section.  Looks like an easy fix with the right parts.  Would like to know if anyone else is seeing this issue or am I the only lucky one?  I am still going to try and contact MTH just to let them know what is up.  In the automotive world we would call this a silent recal.  If someone contacted us we would definately give them free parts or service but did not always publicize issues like this unless we felt it was widely spread. 

I have 4 PS3 engines running on FastTrack and no problems (except when I reverse polarity on different sections but that is a different issue).

Figured it was just me.  I spoke with MTH and they are sending me 2 of the older style rollers which are a little longer.  Here is the embarrassing part.  After speaking with MTH I pried up on the rollers and they moved/bent enough where the engine works fine now.  I guess all is well that ends well except I bought another transformer as the sales store convinced me that was the issue.  Gonna have to set up 2 tracks now.  Live and learn.

Thanks

But look how much fun you had.  Plus, think of all the folks who put on their respective thinking caps to offer suggestions.  In the end, the simplest thing was the answer lurking around the corner.

I did learn a lot on this one and appreciate all the responses from people, even the service tech at MTH was helpfull and glad to send out the necessary parts.

Not sure I am ready for the DCS but started working on an elevated system for the second track.

Glad I found this site.

Did they look like normal, and you bent further out to make contact, or did it look like they where bent in and you straightened them?

 

I have seen the ocassional weak spring (some times an over current can damage them).   G

No they were definately straight, I bent them out slightly.  I will install the older longer design as soon as they arrive from MTH.  With the shorter roller the tolerance for error is extremely slight although they will work as long as no other manufacturing variances exist but when a series of parts are assembled and different variances exist in the operating envioronments at some point such as my case there will be a failure.  MTH was very quick to send me the other rollers.

Newbie;

Good work in finding the problem. I have heard of this happening to one other person a couple years back. He ended up just bending the pickups down as you have. I do agree the longer pickups are a better fix.

Oh, and don't sweat the extra Z-1000, when you get DCS you will want more bricks anyway. 

I'm using 2 now and once I expand the layout I'll want more.

The TIU has separate power circuits for each channel, the more channels you use the better signal you get. Yes, you can daisy chain the inputs from one brick, but you can overload a Z-1000 brick easily with a long passenger consist and a big engine.

Since you need blocks for DCS to work best, having extra bricks to feed them helps.

 

If you wire creatively, you can alternate power brick & TIU Channel to every other block of track and split the load of a long passenger consist across the 2 bricks.

Thanks for the response.  It is amazing to me how much you all know and how intricate this hobby has become.  I have rewired cars and diagnosed all kinds of electrical issues with cars but this DCS stuff is greak to me.  I am finishing up a restoration on a 1973 Honda CL175 but after that plan to purchase some books on DCS and finally take the leap.  I have some space set aside for a permanent layout in the basement and hope to get started later this summer.