New Train Room Finally Getting A Layout! (Last Update: 07/02/2022)

Another day, today was leveling day.  The layout is on carpet, and without some pads, it was sinking unevenly into the carpet.  Legs could also move around, time to solve those problems.  The Tom Tee patented fix, pads with teeth!  A do-nut of plywood, a depression for the leg adjuster, and a piece of office chair mat with teeth glued to the bottom.  These go under the legs and keep the leg from moving and also provide a much wider base for the leg.

Of course, then there's the Pergo floor, the teeth didn't seem to stick there.  So, a similar do-nut without the teeth and add a layer of carpet tape to keep the leg in place.

Legs are all level, top is all attached, time to move on to the last of the first layout of fascia and then the Homasote goes on.

John, neat trick for the adjustors, keeping the layout in place is always a good thing, be glad your not in California, they move a lot.

I wish more train enthusiasts lived closer, it is fun having the layout, but regular running sessions also would be nice.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

A couple places up the street are for sale Jim, want me to refer you to an agent?

GRJ, thanks for the offer, but I am going to have to pass.  I am following in your footsteps.  I am just about 6 months behind you.

We bought a ranch townhome in late March.  Rented it back to the previous owner for the month of April.  We they moved out we cleaned it out and hired painters to paint all the rooms on the main level and the 1700 sgft finished basement.  Finally closed the sale of our previous house on June 20th.

We are all moved in and currently the kitchen if being remodeled,  new cabinets, sink, counter tops, dishwasher and lighting.

I am just a bit ahead of you with the layout build.  Bench work completed, all track ( 2 main lines and a 7-track pass thru yard) laid, wired, debugged and fully ballest. Signals being installed, scenery about 5% completed.  All structures are built and weathered.  Access lift gate needs some fine tuning.

BTW, layout is HO, 22’ x 11’ being professionally built as per the track plan that was first submitted in June of last year.  Final version of track plan submitted in November and construction started December 28 along with a 33% down payment.

Expected delivery late September / early October.

Long story short, moving again is out of the question.

 PS -  I have not posted anything about my layout because this forum is O Gauge.

The difference between a finish carpenter and a framing carpenter......

Lol Hokie, that is very true,

Hokie, The Forstner bit provides an even floor in a shallow hole enough to limit leg movement yet provides  access for adjustment.  A drill press of any size is helpful in providing a level floor.

The clear plastic floor mat with carpet nipples is available at Staples.  I use a hole saw for round coasters and their mat interface.   A chop saw can be used for square coasters and chair mats.

I actually tack the mats on the bottom.

I use a 1 1/4" bit for Mianne adjusters.

Tom, I love the tools you guys are using, never heard of a Forstner bit but it is the perfect thing for the job. As many have mentioned, a real learning experience  for me and thanks to both of you for posting the details. 

You are really doing it right..... compared to......

Hokie,  Not sure of what you are saying.  Your photo is of a Monoco swivel leveler with a 1 1/2"  nylon face.  That stem is a 3/8-16 thread with a top hex for adjusting when used with external mounting brackets.  A significant up grade from the feet that came with the bench work kit.  The Monoco face will swivel to conform to irregular surfaces so as to provide full contact.

Adjustment is much easier in recessed sub feet with the 9/16" nut immediately above the foot.  I discovered them when I was building Free-mo modules a long time ago.

That is a much more preferred adjustable foot.  Considerably more expensive.  I have been using them for 19 years.

If that is the leveler you are using you have made a wise choice.

I will try to post top and bottom photos of both styles.

Does Tom do scenery too ? ....looks like yah gonnah need another pair of hands with that monster...

I'm sure the scenery will take some time to complete, of course it'll probably never be "complete".

Tom, I liked what you guys did a lot and thought my t nut on a board was sort of crude (to be kind to my carpentry skills).  Nice to hear you think highly of them.  I lucked into them in a big box store if I remember correctly.

Tom Tee posted:

Hokie,  Not sure of what you are saying.  Your photo is of a Monoco swivel leveler with a 1 1/2"  nylon face.  That stem is a 3/8-16 thread with a top hex for adjusting when used with external mounting brackets.  A significant up grade from the feet that came with the bench work kit.  The Monoco face will swivel to conform to irregular surfaces so as to provide full contact.

The one part of the leg levelers for the Mianne benchwork that I like is the threaded insert for the leg, it works much better than the one pictured above with the T-Nut.  T-Nuts work their way out of the leg far too easily.  Once you pound the the Mianne nuts in, they're not coming out without a fight.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

I'm sure the scenery will take some time to complete, of course it'll probably never be "complete".

John, Model railroads are never completed. The NMRA has visited my so-called completed railroad off and on for over a decade. But, I still have a box of detail stuff i need to add when i get "around to it." And that box gets more cluttered every time i go to a train show. Plus the scenery always needs to be refreshed. Creating and building a model railroad can easily be half the fun.

John is absolutely correct.  I stock both kinds of "T" nuts.  IME,  The two different "T" nuts are for two different types of wood.

The Mianne legs are a harder better quality wood.  Hardwood is a much stronger unyielding material and is given to prefer the so called "Propeller" nuts which install with an interference fit as shown in John's photo. 

I use the Mianne selection of propeller nuts and fixed feet for display modules I used to travel with.  

For benchwork installation I usually used a Fir leg and use the nuts with the impaling nuts which are  for softer wood.   Soft wood does not provide a long lasting interference fit.

When using either style of nut , I also coat the interface with Locktite's urethane adhesive and leave it cure overnight to assure an secure installation.  They need to be chiseled out when removed.

The higher adjustable 9/16"  hex nut built into the lower portion Monoco leveler makes adjustment quick n' easy.

IMO, just consider the type of host wood used.

Edit:  I failed to mention one of the main reasons I switched to use the finned nut.  When I used to deliver layouts I was not always sure how much runout the floor may have.  So I would usually start off with long adjustable leveler stems.  If my predrilled hole was just a tad off it would jack a long "T" nut off it's base when the stem hit a wall being screwed deep into the leg.  So I usually drilled a slightly oversized hole which allowed for runout.  Propeller nuts MUST have only one perfect sized hole, a natural for shorter stems.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Tom Tee posted:

Hokie,  Not sure of what you are saying.  Your photo is of a Monoco swivel leveler with a 1 1/2"  nylon face.  That stem is a 3/8-16 thread with a top hex for adjusting when used with external mounting brackets.  A significant up grade from the feet that came with the bench work kit.  The Monoco face will swivel to conform to irregular surfaces so as to provide full contact.

The one part of the leg levelers for the Mianne benchwork that I like is the threaded insert for the leg, it works much better than the one pictured above with the T-Nut.  T-Nuts work their way out of the leg far too easily.  Once you pound the the Mianne nuts in, they're not coming out without a fight.

John:

Can the type of nuts that Mianne uses be purchased anywhere. If so, what are they called?

Tom apparently knows where to get them, I haven't seen them when I looked for this kind of stuff.

 Propeller "T" nuts,  They are available at big box stores, many hardware stores, valley hardware in CA and Outwater in north jersey.

Sample shots:

The brackets on the left are to mound adjustable levelers after a layout is up.

If the concern is the T-nut pulling out, you can get them with screws. With a little thread locking adhesive, they're probably not going anywhere, but they are a little pricey.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/8-HEA...e:g:5IEAAOSwE~1b5a6k

Just search "Flanged propeller T nuts".

Failing to insert the "T"  will give you marine hardware.

I didn't turn those up when I used that Tom, they were all the standard T-nuts.  I did find this in a related search, probably a decent hold.  It's screwed in with a hex wrench, I suspect it would have excellent hold.

Hi John,  That looks like a typical drywall Tee nut for hanging decent sized loads.  I use them for heavy pictures. 

Also used in inexpensive soft core boards typical of IKEA type construction.

The drywall version usually has a pointed nose so you can just jam it through the drywall, twist and set in place using a Phillips screw driver.

Tom, I have lots of the drywall models, they have a point and also a larger flat flange to seat to the drywall.

Tom Tee posted:

 Propeller "T" nuts,  They are available at big box stores, many hardware stores, valley hardware in CA and Outwater in north jersey.

Sample shots:

The brackets on the left are to mound adjustable levelers after a layout is up.

Now I like those.

I've used this combination with great success on all the 2x4 legs of my layout.

WoW and Super WoW, Gunner!!

Shipment from Ross came in, another $800 flies away for five switches, this layout is getting mighty expensive!

John, I had to put the blinders on when paying for the fastrack, switches and DCS, Legacy systems, I know my layout is somewhere in the $15k range but not knowing lets me look the spouse in the eye and say I have no clue.

There are 27 switches on the layout, and about 400 feet of track, 2 legacy Cab 2, 1 TIU, 4 AIU and one Wifi DCS.

I'll just smile and say it was a bargain.

27 switches is a lot, I will end up with around a dozen before I tackle the yard extension.

LOL John, I tell the wife what everything cost me, that way she throws me a little more here and there! Plus when I do go she has an idea what she might get if she sells everything! LOL

It looks like you are spending more money on tools than trains.

eddie g posted:

It looks like you are spending more money on tools than trains.

Not really.  I did have to pick up a compressor, mine crapped out.  I bought one just like Tom's, the Porter-Cable 6 Gal model.  I also did buy the DeWalt portable worksite saw, very nice piece.  

I think Tom has every woodworking tool on the planet, so I haven't needed much.

John, if I didn't have the yard ladders it would be in the 8 to 10 range for switches, I have 4 yard entrances and within each yard several steps to the ladders which added up a lot quicker than I thought, I also wanted to be able to switch main lines on any of the 4 sides which added more in plus the reversing elevated section.

I'm guessing the yard will add a bunch, that's in the future.  I already have $3,000 in track and switches, and this really isn't that complicated a layout!

gunrunnerjohn posted:

eddie g posted:

It looks like you are spending more money on tools than trains.

Not really.  I did have to pick up a compressor, mine crapped out.  I bought one just like Tom's, the Porter-Cable 6 Gal model.  I also did buy the DeWalt portable worksite saw, very nice piece.  

I think Tom has every woodworking tool on the planet, so I haven't needed much.

Porter-Cable makes great power tools.  I had a friend that worked for them and every year right before Father's Day they would offer employees tools at a very nice (around 40%) discount.  He would get me  whatever I needed.

Their stuff is really tuff.  I have since passed most of that to my son and he loves it!  He should... he got it FREE.  

Agree about Porter-Cable being the best although much of their production is no longer in the U.S. My wife's late husband had over a dozen P-C tools. What I didn't want we sold. The only thing left for sale is a plate joiner which has no model RR application.

Man, I'm losing my patience here. Are we running yet? Where's the trains? 

Let's go! Throw down a loop and run something already. 

Yes, I am not a patient person.

As we are on the topic of tools, if you already don't have one, the Harbor Freight cut off saw is great for cutting track.  We use it at the club and I built several layouts with it.  The track fits into the built-in clamp, straight cuts every time.   You can usually pick it up for $30-35 with sale/coupon.

Bob, one of those is in my future.

Engineer-Joe posted:

Man, I'm losing my patience here. Are we running yet? Where's the trains? 

Let's go! Throw down a loop and run something already. 

Yes, I am not a patient person.

 Like fine wine, some fine layouts need ageing!

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Bob, one of those is in my future.

Engineer-Joe posted:

Man, I'm losing my patience here. Are we running yet? Where's the trains? 

Let's go! Throw down a loop and run something already. 

Yes, I am not a patient person.

 Like fine wine, some fine layouts need ageing!

LOL!

Tell him John.... it has to breathe.. 🚂