I think we just had a good argument put forth as to why Sunset/Third Rail ought to consider putting out GP-7 and GP-9 models with the factory closure. I was one of the people caught up in the last one and had to wait several years for my Atlas F-3s.
If push comes to shove I could do some MP GP's. I missed the Atlas ones, as I hadn't switched to O yet. I don't even intend to model MP, I just like the as-delivered paint scheme.
My preference is still for accurate GP38-2's thought.
P.S On the waiting list for two SD40-2's.
Purplepapa posted:I could be very enthusiastic about a GP7 in ACL or SAL in 2 rail. Also a GP20 in Santa Fe.
SAL and Southern too, please!
.
I'm done ….
….. concerning GP7's or RS-3/RSD5's or even-end cab switchers from 3rd Rail. Its not in the stars, and that's cool. I'm not part of their targeted niche.
I'm glad that they do make very nicely/correctly detailed model train stuff for their enthusiasts. The bigger our hobby, the better.
EBT Jim posted:.
I'm done ….
….. concerning GP7's or RS-3/RSD5's or even-end cab switchers from 3rd Rail. Its not in the stars, and that's cool. I'm not part of their targeted niche.
I'm glad that they do make very nicely/correctly detailed model train stuff for their enthusiasts. The bigger our hobby, the better.
Patience is a virtue... For 2 rail O scalers. 
brwebster posted:Looking back over figures given in Pennsy Power II, seems as if there may have potentially been 8 GP7's so equipped. Eight were equipped with steam boilers so moving reservoirs up top to accommodate a larger fuel tank was certainly possible.
Bruce
Unfortunately. Only three GP7's had rooftop torpedo tubes, DuaL Cab Controls, and cab signaling boxes underneath #8551-8553.
From the Paul Withers book "Pennsylvania Railroad Diesel Locomotive Pictorial" Vol#8.
The Devil is in the details!
Here are some 3 rail photos of PRR Atlas GP7's compared to Lionel GP7:
Atlas O definitely got the handrails right! However the Lionel GP7 with the Legacy electronics is only off by the Handrail detail.
I wish I could have said the same with the Lionel Legacy GP9 but they FUBARed it up with the details. With the Legacy electronic"crew talk" you can't really fix the numerous issues.
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If the Atlas GP7s and GP9s had single motor drives, they would be **** near perfect. Unfortunately, they use the two motor drive. Sunset's single motor drive will be superior every time. Thankfully, Atlas did their GP7s in Lackawanna. I doubt Scott would get enough reservations for the Lackawanna paint scheme.
Opinion.
I use two motor drives in my larger Diesel models. Other than double the current, which doesn't seem to affect my electric bills, the only effect I see is increased pulling power. I suppose it is different if you use DCC, but my motors do not fight each other. Same with steamers - I often have three locomotives tied together.
ecd15 posted:If the Atlas GP7s and GP9s had single motor drives, they would be **** near perfect. Unfortunately, they use the two motor drive. Sunset's single motor drive will be superior every time. Thankfully, Atlas did their GP7s in Lackawanna. …...
Opinion.
My friend has an Atlas Reading GP7 with the original QSI system, and we have it running smoothly at something less than 1 smph.
Not yours?
Jim
Atlas O definitely got the handrails right
it appears Atlas modeled the cast steel stanchions, while Lionel modeled the pressed steel ones. EMD changed the stanchion style during manufacture.
PRR Man posted:Atlas O definitely got the handrails right
it appears Atlas modeled the cast steel stanchions, while Lionel modeled the pressed steel ones. EMD changed the stanchion style during manufacture.
True but, the vertical handrail stanchions (solid bar stock on GP7) were changed to the "U channel" pressed steel (GP9 type), very late in the GP7 production. Thus, careful research of new builder photos of GP7 units would be in order to model the correct "U channel" vertical handrail stanchions.
I would love to see 3rd Rail do something new and different like a Baldwin AS-16 or Baby Face. I know several roads used the former but sadly only three or four used the latter but it would still be exciting to see.
The F units and Geeps are some of my favorite locos as they are a great representation of first generation diesel power but I agree they are way overdone. All Nation, Overland, P & D Hobby, Kemtron, Hallmark, Atlas, Red Caboose, MTH, Sunset....
The golden goose can lay only so many eggs.
I could go for a S&A AS616 or any other Baldwin road switcher for that matter. I just love the look of them.
prrjim posted:I'd be in for at least 2 PRR GP9s for general freight service. PRR had about 300 I think. I would probably be tempted by more if they did the late version with single large radiator fan instead of the two small ones. I'd go for the 2 small ones first however, no question.
Then I'd be in for a GP7 with the "torpedo" air tanks on the roof for a local passenger train.
Yes the reservation system seems to work pretty well. An announcement is made and we all jump in, or we don't and scott decides to do the product based on that. I think I have heard the target is about 1000 units to get the current price level. If we settle for a lot fewer units, the prices goes up considerably.
310, but who's counting?
I would like a GP7/9 in the red paint scheme of the CNJ
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Hot Water posted:PRR Man posted:Atlas O definitely got the handrails right
it appears Atlas modeled the cast steel stanchions, while Lionel modeled the pressed steel ones. EMD changed the stanchion style during manufacture.
True but, the vertical handrail stanchions (solid bar stock on GP7) were changed to the "U channel" pressed steel (GP9 type), very late in the GP7 production. Thus, careful research of new builder photos of GP7 units would be in order to model the correct "U channel" vertical handrail stanchions.
Atlas GP7 has the solid bar handrail stanchions.
You could always go vintage
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aterry11 posted:You could always go vintage
Image Not Found!!!!!
Folks: Reservations are looking strong, right out of the gate. So we will be focusing on this project to produce it after the Krauss Maffei, early next year.
Because of how a factory can hold your project hostage if they control all aspects of design, tooling and production as AFFA Tech and Sanda Kan had. We compartmentalize our production process, using separate subcontractors to perform those duties. The "Factory" just assembles, decorate and tests the final product. And any assembly house can be brought up to speed in a matter of months since the Korea production manager works for me. It's kept us out of trouble all these years. You don't want to own a factory in China, there's too much corruption and red tape. It takes your focus away from making trains.
Thanks for your input and support on the GP7, GP9 paint schemes. We will follow all detail differences to the best of our ability, including the railing differences between GP7s and 9s that HotWater pointed out. The new software in our QSI "Titan" series is called Q3, and we are the first to bring this to production. The E8s were the first and the improvement in 2 Rail running characteristics was noticeable right from the start. Then the PAs and now the E5/E6s and so on. Here we go.... It's true, ESU is much easier to install in a different model and configure, but QSI still shines in their DC operation characteristics where are patented.
If your serious, put your reservation in: http://www.3rdrail.com/reservation.htm
Thanks,
Scott Mann - China
hibar posted:I would think that the GP 7,9,18 and 20 as one run would get sufficient reservations, it appears that beyond first generation diesels there is not enough market interest for more modern diesels [case in point SD-40-2s] at Sunsets price point bearing in mind that the "street price" from MTH,Lionel and Atlas averages 450+/- for most diesels and most buyers want at least a pair. Scott is dependent on both 3 and 2 rail orders to make his numbers. JMO
I'm all over the GP20. They are next to impossible to find in 2 Rail.
Dave
CentralFan1976 posted:Rule292 posted:CentralFan1976 posted:What we need are some GP18/20s!
The Central’s GP20s are some of, if not the the most beautifully proportioned of the EMD hood units.
I’m sure Scott would make darn near any locomotive we wanted. It just has to reserve and sell
Thus the conundrum of our hobby. It doesn’t matter how popular GP7/9s or -38-2s were or SD40-2s were on the prototypes, at the end of the day the hobby is about big and fun and neat and what sells is Big Boys, Challengers, H8s, GG1s, Daylights and E/F units.
No love for a Sunset SD40-2, which is arguably one of the most important locomotives of the past 40 years, yet a Kraus-Maffei is on the drawing board.
Not a bad thing, just human nature.
It’s not just the Central’s that I believe would appeal to mass production. Differences in shrouded fans, and details like the bulged sides, seldom-modeled vertical grab irons and famous paint schemes like the NYC, ATSF, SP, NYSW and so many other short lines make this a popular locomotive. A loco like this is begging for single motor drive, because of the low hood constraints.
thanks,
Mario
YESSSSSS!
Not popular enough, Pennsy didn't have any!
I would want a NYC, Penn Central, and Conrail model...not necessarily Pennsy.
Just a little tease. NYC seemed to have a few of them.
LUVINDEMTRAINS... Aren't those called Alligators on the Santa Fe..?
Blue and Yellow if I remember.
aterry11 posted:LUVINDEMTRAINS... Aren't those called Alligators on the Santa Fe..?
Blue and Yellow if I remember.
No. The "Alligators" were an Alco 6 axle unit, with a VERY long low short hood on the front. Other railroads had the Alco "Alligators" also, even the C&O, but with a high, long front hood.
Well aterry11 there you have it...lol.
"The new software in our QSI "Titan" series is called Q3, and we are the first to bring this to production. The E8s were the first and the improvement in 2 Rail running characteristics was noticeable right from the start. Then the PAs and now the E5/E6s and so on. Here we go.... It's true, ESU is much easier to install in a different model and configure, but QSI still shines in their DC operation characteristics where are patented. "
Could someone that owns one of these 3rd Rail engines provide some real world numbers that back up this claim?
Thanks
Jim
I would take a GP20 in Milwaukee colors.
Dick
CBQer posted:I would take a GP20 in Milwaukee colors.
Dick
Did the Milwaukee Road have any GP20 units?
One quick question...
What color will the unpainted GP7 models be?
If they're flat black. I'm in.
CBQer posted:I would take a GP20 in Milwaukee colors.
Dick
Hot Water posted:CBQer posted:I would take a GP20 in Milwaukee colors.
Dick
Did the Milwaukee Road have any GP20 units?
No and so far Scott has not added the GP-20 to the current reservation list, 260 were built going to 8 RRs so if enough requests come in they might be added it would require low nose tooling.
aterry11 posted:LUVINDEMTRAINS... Aren't those called Alligators on the Santa Fe..?
Blue and Yellow if I remember.
Alco C420, Steamtown National Historic Site. ??Alligator?? I could be wrong and often. 
Bowser has a kit for the radio phone antenna. Brass wire is additional, not part of the kit.
PRR Antenna Support Set
#190-3050 GP-9
I had done phone antenna on a Weaver U25 and a set of Weaver E8's using Bowser/Cal Scale brass detail parts.
Mike CT posted:aterry11 posted:LUVINDEMTRAINS... Aren't those called Alligators on the Santa Fe..?
Blue and Yellow if I remember.
Alco C420, Steamtown National Historic Site. ??Alligator?? I could be wrong and often.
Alligator? Nope. Only the RSD15's were referred to as alligators.
Rusty
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Rusty Traque posted:Mike CT posted:aterry11 posted:LUVINDEMTRAINS... Aren't those called Alligators on the Santa Fe..?
Blue and Yellow if I remember.
Alco C420, Steamtown National Historic Site. ??Alligator?? I could be wrong and often.
Alligator? Nope. Only the RSD15's were referred to as alligators.
Rusty
Thank you 
An Update on the Geeps by 3rd Rail:
Production is set for this Fall. Contracts signed, parts and tooling are ordered. We are on our way. I have emailed those with reservations to confirm. If you are interested, do put in a reservation as in the shuffle almost everyone gets what they want out of these projects. If we get your order soon.
http://www.3rdrail.com/reservation.html#GP79
Thank you all again for making this project possible.
Scott Mann
And they said it wouldn't be done... It's funny to look back and read the posts by the self-appointed "experts".
I've got my reservations in. Now to figure out if I can afford any more... What do kidneys go for these days? As a 2R guy I am fairly certain that these could be the last newly tooled 2R Geeps that we will ever see produced in O scale. I wouldn't recommend sitting this one out. If you EVER want a RTR DCC/Sound equipped 2R Geep you better find a way to get in on these.
Scott, I hope you do a second run in the future. F units and Geeps are a lot for the wallet to absorb in one year. If you take a break and come back to them I'd be in for a few more.
Nothing like a trip down memory lane.
-Crank
