Traction Tire Alternatives

Why do you think you're having so many problems with standard traction tires?  Some folks have mentioned using something like rubber adhesive to stick them on while still allowing them to be removed for replacement.

In 10 years I have never thrown a tire (of course I don't run my trains at high speeds), I'm more concerned about making the ones one my engines last.  Is there anything that can be done to make them not get dried out and brittle?

I'm not sure there's anything to keep them from aging, you should be so lucky as to have them age sufficiently for them to crack!

The only ones I've thrown are from used equipment, and I have no idea what kind of abuse they've had before I got them.  I do find that once a tire has been thrown, it's rarely useful to try to reuse the same one.

Hi John,

>This time of the year I run my trains more often.

>I find that the 042 curves on my layout are tough on traction tires. Small diameter curves tend to put a side scuffing action on the tires. This is especially the case for tires on the inside rail of loop running trains, and also especially prevalent for 8-wheeled steamers.

>Earlier this year I stopped using fluid track cleaners because it was softening the tires.

>I do not always have proper fitting replacement tires. Some replacement tires are too wide for the grooves in the drivers, and some replacement tires do not have the right material elasticity.

Last evening three engines lost traction tires. Rather than layup engines awaiting new traction tires to arrive in the mail, I am of the mindset to try silicone or Bull Frog Snot.

I was unimpressed with Bullfrog Snot, I'd try the silicon replacement trick.

For years I've heard the black Permatex from Auto Parts stores works very well.  Fill the tire slot, then when it dries, trim the excess.

We use alcohol in the track cleaner and it doesn't leave any residue or have an ill effect on tires when the track dries.

Bullfrog snot and any other silicon type tire replacement will never be as smooth to the wheel as a traction tire.  This causes a noticeable wobble on your engine. Trackwork has alot to do with traction tire wear too.  All those track joints cut into the tires  If you use insulated rails fill in any gaps with silicon to prevent the cuts

I've got to try the permatex and see how it works.  I've used something I think is similar to Bullfrog snot - its the plastic "goo" you buy at Home Depot and such, made for dipping tool handles (pliers, etc) in to "robber coat" them.  Works about as well as Bullfrog - can't see any difference, actually.

This causes a noticeable wobble on your engine.

Hay Ben, is this before the Beer or after? I like the Bullfrog Snot. BF

Wooops  Maybe it was me that was wobbling   Starting to be shaped like a weeble too.

I like Bull Frog Snot......sniff .....hock,,,,,ptewee....snort. Tom in PGH

Two things are detrimental to traction tires -- smoke fluid (oil) and overloading. If you try to pull too much, the tires tend to stretch, then they pop off. If you get oil on them, they slip and stretch. Cleaning everything with alcohol and then using rubber cement in the groove will keep them in place, but they're easily removable.

I like the Permatex idea and will look into it as I don't like servicing traction tire problems.

One other thing to look for if you are suffering from premature tyre wear, is the condition of track joints. Large gaps, or uneven joins can damage traction tyres very quickly.

The permatex solution works great.  Much cheaper than Bullfrog snot. I forget who originally posted this idea a few years back, but what a lifesaver for me. I did not want to take my steamers apart, and gave this method a try. The key is to let the silicon cure.  I was in a rush and although dry it lasted only a couple of weeks the first time. The next time , I put on two layers and let it cure for about a week. It has lasted over two years pulling 14 passenger cars. I put the engine upside down in a modified foam cradle and applied power. The wheels were moving very slow, faster spins permatex all over the wheels and is time consuming to take off. Don't ask me how I know this.  I used a Popsicle stick to smooth it as it spun. One of the best tips I have learned on the forum.

Good Luck,

Bob

There is one thing DCS users can do that may extend the life of traction tires, and that is to get into the menu and cut back on the acceleration rate and also the deceleration rate. I think the factory setting is 4 mphps. I changed mine to 2 mphps. It is interesting that on some of my engines the tires last a long time, on others I seem to always be replacing them.

recently I have been buying MTH two rail engines, which avoids this problem entirely.

if your handy at working on toy trains you can

pull the traction tire drive wheel and replace

it with a solid drive wheel.

Well, you also probably want to have a press handy to do the job properly.

That's true, a press would be handy. Ive had good luck with an old piece

of rail (actual stuff about 10" long, makes a great anvil), and carefull

alienment and a well placed smack with a hammer.

I tried running some engines without traction tires and the result was not acceptable, not even on flat track. Traction tires are a must have.

My  next steps in this adventure are to try:

> one or two sizes smaller tires than the OEM tire size;

> silicone paste.

I don't get the feeling from yawl that Bull Frog Snot works well as traction tire material, so I am not spending $25 for a tiny bottle of it.

Beer is out as I don't like the taste of the stuff. Well maybe a Spatan Dark if it's on tap, but no yellow beer.

Did you notice that yellow beer goes in and comes out the same color? That's cause yellow beer has no bodily or socially redeeming values.

While we are on fluids, here's another anecdote. Coffee feels as good going in as it does coming out if you hold it long enough! He he.

Can you imagine what a newbie might think reading this post?

...and that's exactly what I did and it improved the pulling power significantly on this

Railking RS1.This train is pulling 16 Railking Die Cast cars plus a caboose.

TRACTION TIRES SUCK !!!

this one minute video is on 072 track

I have very few problems with traction tires. The trick is to not stretch them out like elastic bands when you put them on. I don't use "snots" or anything else but the proper size tire.

I have used rubber cement with success. It doesn't dry out and brittle like some others. Another benefit is it doesn't "permanently" adhere the tire to the wheel so it is easily removed.

The traction tires on the new 3rd Rail E7s have a cross-hatched design on them.  I would think/hope they hold up better than the smooth rubber tires on all my other engines.

in a pinch, when i didnt have a replacement traction

tire, I have used rubber bands.

Only steel wheels for me

I'm a proponent of using silicone sealant (this is not caulk).  I can send you instructions and a photo of the product if you like.  My email address is in my profile.  By the way, my trains don't wobble.

.....

Dennis

Rubber cement has always done the trick for me. Some locos are just more prone to throwing tires than others even though they are run over the same track joints and for about the same length of time.

I definitely agree that very heavy loads stretch the tires and can lead to losing them. Starting fast with a heavy load probably worsens this. All of the locomotives that I've had throw tires have been pulling 15 or more freight cars or 7 or more passenger cars. We get spoiled by the pulling capability those thin rubber tires add and sometimes overload them.

Lots of  wasted technology and money on useless crap like crew talk which could have been applied to powerful anti-slip electro magna traction reading wheel acceleration off the optical tape. 

Which doesn't work at all on Atlas track...

In some cases, additional weight on the rails has worked for me just as in the prototype as some engines I had were too featherweight. Otherwise, those rubber bands that are packaged in a variety of sizes do just fine with some rubber cement.. The wheels need to be thoroughly cleaned beforehand. I do not want to be cleaning up or reapplying any goop. I have a jar of the Bullfrog stuff that I never opened as the more I thought about it, application seemed like a hit or miss hassle.

Atlas O makes steel track!!!

Given the choice between the nickel-silver and the steel track, it's a no-brainer!  Do you really prefer steel over something that doesn't rust?

Im a postwar guy, so I like rails that magna traction

will stick to.

I like Bill's idea of smart magna traction...Is that really doable ?

Traction control requires measuring the speed of an undriven wheel and the driven wheels to determine if you have wheel slip. It could be done, but I don't get the feeling it'll be cheap.

Got to remember that these are toy trains. Increasing technology [cost] will decrease the customer base [demand].

I got a remedy for that!!

Post war Lionel Steamers with

Magna Traction. Run em fast and

furious!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(and dont forget to smoke em!!!!)

My wife hates it when I smoke up the train room,

she wont come in when Im running smokers!!!!!!!!!!!!

Someone posted some time ago a traction control circuit for K-Line(or Williams, Lionel, etc.) diesels that have their DC motors wired in series to eliminate the differential effect if the traction between motor trucks is unequal.  This could probably be adapted to many different situations at the "O" model level.

Pulling  or sliding an engine on the rails when not running does great damage.  usually you will find one off after doing that especially with the very heavy diecast engines>