Great concept. Poor execution. I bought an HO identical version of this car by Tangent in plastic for $44.95 a couple of years ago. A plastic O-Scale version in the $150-$175 area would hit the mark, albeit still pricier than Atlas-O or Intermountain (when available). I wish the company luck in potential future offerings of desirable O-Scale products because, well because there is never too much of a good thing.
@EastCoastIron posted:Explain please, Bill.
Happy Holidays
ECI
The idea of this uncommon car becoming available in O-Scale is great. The idea of a new manufacturer offering O-Scale products is great. The switch from Tangent's standard plastic to brass is potentially problematic and their price point will exclude many in our scale. I'm concerned that poor sales will simply lead another manufacturer to conclude that there is no O-Scale market; whereas the suggestion in my original post is that this could be a winner if done somewhat differently.
Bill, Did you notice Tangent's response on the cost of O Sale plastic tooling on the first page:
"New tooling for O Scale cars costs well into the $6 figures"
ECI
@Bill Chaplik posted:The idea of this uncommon car becoming available in O-Scale is great. The idea of a new manufacturer offering O-Scale products is great. The switch from Tangent's standard plastic to brass is potentially problematic and their price point will exclude many in our scale. I'm concerned that poor sales will simply lead another manufacturer to conclude that there is no O-Scale market; whereas the suggestion in my original post is that this could be a winner if done somewhat differently.
But Tangent already concluded that they do not see a big enough market for their products in plastic in O Scale (see quote from Tangent highlighted below - taken from an earlier post in this same thread). Just because a manufacturer makes a model in plastic in HO scale does not mean that their machines are 100% portatble to O scale. O Scale models takes a whole other level of commitment in machines versus HO as far manufacturing is concerned. Injection molding machines double or triple in clamping force tonnage as do injection volume requirements for O scale. CNC machines needed to have significantly larger travel dimensions. Existing mold bases cannot be reused and new ones need to be purchased. HO uses mostly plastic truck side frames, O scale high-volume cars generally use die cast trucks, again new die cast tooling and molding capabilities need to be sourced for this, either in-house or contracted out. It is no where's near a slam dunk to just make an O scale version of a piece of rolling stock when you already make it in a smaller scale.
In addition, as much as we hate to admit it, we need to involve a the 3-railers in any plastic model to justify the tooling cost and get enough volume. I am sure that this manufacturer recognizes this too. There just is not enough demand in 2-Rail to justify a newly-tooled 2-Rail-only plastic model (in any modeling era). Maybe this builder does not want to invest in tooling up for three different "gauges" (O5W, P48, 3-Rail) and also make two types of couplers (e.g. 2-Rail and Lobster Claws). They state in their quote below that they "do not and will not offer one size fits all models". That doesn't mean that some other manufacturer down the road will not be willing to embrace this manufacturing model. Can't we just be glad that someone new took a chance with O scale for a change? I have no interest in this car (not my era) but I understand why they did what they did and maybe down the road they will make something that I am interested in, even if it is expensive brass car.
Quote from Tangent:
Tangent Scale Models - This is what we wrote in our O scale newsletter: Why a Brass model? Our decision to provide a hand-crafted model constructed from brass - as our first foray into O scale - is simple. We are testing the waters for this market, both in style of product offered (painted and RTR) as well as what sort of volume the market will support. We understand that some customers might prefer a plastic-based model, however that is very unlikely from us in O scale. New tooling for O Scale cars costs well into the $6 figures, and a majority of our HO scale tooling has multiple variations in parts and bodies which effectively doubles or triples the plastic tooling cost. We do not and will not offer simple "one size fits all" models. O Scale Brass can yield beautiful results, as our first model has demonstrated.
Scott
I welcome Tangent to the O scale market. With that said, I suggest producing a freight car from the 1970s - 2000s era in plastic. The tank car is beautiful but it is for those who model the steam era.
Most of us, I'll say 75% want something that we see on todays current railroads. I believe the sales would be much more impressive and the 6 figures it takes to make plastic molds/tooling will pay for itself in the long run.
I model Illinois Central in the "dark star" paint scheme. I'm chomping at the bit to get my hands on those new cabooses on the Tangent web site.
Okay buy em and help support Tangent going into the O scale market.
As was said, if they came out with specialty cars like sets of USN or other Helium cars I'd be in.
Otherwise, Lionel and Atlas are fine for me.
@Scott Kay posted:Can't we just be glad that someone new took a chance with O scale for a change? I have no interest in this car (not my era) but I understand why they did what they did and maybe down the road they will make something that I am interested in, even if it is expensive brass car.
Sure, and they even have delivered - there's a concept that others might try to embrace.
Their reasoning is perfectly fine for them and their business model.
The comment that they even have delivered is an important point and they way Tangent does business. When they announce the product is available for shipment, a concept that is a rarity in the HO market for sure. I have been a customer from the start buying my first car at an NMRA show in 2006 or 2007 from a small display they had. I think they may have had one instance where the product was about to land and they began accepting orders. I would have to back thru my records to confirm the circumstances. There are very few manufacturers that operate this way and it’s one more reason why I support them. As well as their being right over the hill in Asheville.
Tangent and another high end manufacturer known as Arrowhead in Sheridan, WY have set a new standard for customer service. If you buy from these gentlemen you will not regret it.
Great, I mean yeah a new player in O scale instead of just Atlas, Lionel and MTH but that price is out of this world
I gotta admit, the pictures are stunning. It looks like they hit the full size car with a shrink ray. The weathering is all that's missing. I'm a three rail guy but I'll be watching Tangent closely.
Couldn’t help getting one. And… nice is an understatement! Extremely happy with mine. Will have to studio-shoot it!
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I'm sure everyone would love to see more pictures. I know I would!!
How did they package it?
Just as a Key Imports engine. Cloth, plastic wrap, high density foam, tangent box, brown outer box.
