@Norm Charbonneau posted:Legacy upgrade kits would be dreamy.
Have they ever done that?
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Have they ever done that?
No and I doubt they will. Why sell you the electronics when they can sell you a new engine with electronics. While some of the folks here that are comfortable doing the needed work to install existing Legacy electronics into older engines and are able to perform these transplants, I doubt Lionel would produce an upgrade kit that would make it consumer friendly. Just my opinion.
Like Marty said, no and probably not ever. I'd bet mostly due to the customer support time sink that would come along with it. It would still be cool though, and I'm thinking basically packaged like a Legacy ERR setup.
They no longer stock the early Legacy parts, so we can't even repair oem stuff.
No way in **** they would offer an upgrade kit.
Besides, need an upgrade??? Just buy a newer model!😉
Amtrak's Siemens Charger • I shot these at Pontiac Station, Michigan
I was at a friends house last week and he has a HO Layout and he has this in HO Scale. What's up....?
Hope to see you out rail-fanning: Gary 🚂
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@MartyE posted:No and I doubt they will. Why sell you the electronics when they can sell you a new engine with electronics. While some of the folks here that are comfortable doing the needed work to install existing Legacy electronics into older engines and are able to perform these transplants, I doubt Lionel would produce an upgrade kit that would make it consumer friendly. Just my opinion.
Yeah, I wouldn't think they would. The only way they would do any sort of stuff similar to that would be like a warranty repair or replacement where you have to provide proof of purchase or such.
@RickO posted:They no longer stock the early Legacy parts, so we can't even repair oem stuff.
No way in **** they would offer an upgrade kit.
Besides, need an upgrade??? Just buy a newer model!😉
@MartyE posted:No and I doubt they will. Why sell you the electronics when they can sell you a new engine with electronics. While some of the folks here that are comfortable doing the needed work to install existing Legacy electronics into older engines and are able to perform these transplants, I doubt Lionel would produce an upgrade kit that would make it consumer friendly. Just my opinion.
Still though, this could be profitable for them.
I'm guessing they own all the IP, layouts, and other things for the circuit boards, so they could probably take the manufacturing of them anywhere they want. In quantity those boards can't be that expensive. I'm sure someone here with EE experience could do a BoM on them and get a rough idea of parts cost in quantity. I would guess those boards cost under $30 in quantity to Lionel. They could easily charge $200 for them (RCMC + RSLite, smoke unit, pigtail harnesses, speaker, and microswitches, etc.) and do it without any warranty, and wash their hands of it.
Hmm. Then again, for a brief period of time they marketed ERR stuff in their catalog. Even had a Lionel p/n.
Pepperidge Farm remembers:
http://www.lionel.com/products...mmandertrade-6-elrr1
So, for at least a brief moment in time, they weren't averse to offering command control upgrades.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Yeah, we all want that scale T1 Duplex as well, considering how the real life project is coming along, they have to be moving towards bringing one back to the small rails.
I've been hoping this is how it goes down.
@Brian DeFazio posted:Scale rs-3 with legacy. How has this never been done???
I just bought my LC+2.0 RS3's but it sure would be cool to have some done in Legacy. I've also wondered how it hasn't been done. Maybe there's less real estate in the shell for the electronics? I'm planning to just upgrade my RS3's. The LC+2.0 RS3 has been awesome for me.
An "install at your risk" Legacy upgrade kit would be awesome!!
If Lionel no longer stocks legacy parts, what happens if your $1600.00 Legacy engine bites the dust, it can’t be fixed?
@trainroomgary posted:
I was at a friends house last week and he has a HO Layout and he has this in HO Scale. What's up....?
Hey, everything exists in HO scale and there's a lot of stuff you'd assume to already be in O but has never been (and maybe never will).
If I had a nickel for each time I saw something in HO and wished it was also in O, Bill Gates would be shining my shoes right now.
Most of the modern Legacy stuff I look up seems to have full availability of parts on the support site. I remember some of it being listed as 'call for availability' in the past. It's the vintage TMCC stuff (save for an odd LCRU or two) that's been taken out.
@ironman1 posted:If Lionel no longer stocks legacy parts, what happens if your $1600.00 Legacy engine bites the dust, it can’t be fixed?
@Norm Charbonneau posted:Most of the modern Legacy stuff I look up seems to have full availability of parts on the support site. I remember some of it being listed as 'call for availability' in the past. It's the vintage TMCC stuff (save for an odd LCRU or two) that's been taken out.
What's not available any longer is modular electronics (both TMCC and Legacy). All of the RailSounds 4.0, 5.0, 5.5, 6.0 as well as R4LC, DCDS, DCDS-J (Odyssey 1 and 2 motor controllers) and associated smoke regulators are NLA. They were in-stock one day, and gone the next. I think I probably got one of the last RS 6.0 boards they sold because I've been working on a scale T1. Literally like a few weeks after I received my board, they disappeared, right before the warehouse sale.
Legacy repair parts are still available for newer generations. The BEMC, RCMC are still available.
Not to mention all the nice RS4 motherboards for mounting the audio boards and power supplies. So now's their chance to make up for it. Legacy upgrades with RR-specific RS Lite boards. Keep it simple, motor control could be BEMC style.
@Norm Charbonneau posted:Hmm. Then again, for a brief period of time they marketed ERR stuff in their catalog. Even had a Lionel p/n.
Pepperidge Farm remembers:
http://www.lionel.com/products...mmandertrade-6-elrr1
So, for at least a brief moment in time, they weren't averse to offering command control upgrades.
You mean when Dr. ZW @SantaFeFan was working for them? The man behind ERR? I think Lionel bought the business when Jon came to work for them but I'm sure Jon can tell us for sure if he wishes.
" I think Lionel bought the business when Jon came to work for them but I'm sure Jon can tell us for sure if he wishes."
That's my memory of those events. Pretty much simultaneous in time.
Back on the subject of future locomotives, I would also love to see a New Haven I-5 Hudson. They could do a variety of detail variations such as the block lettering or large script on the tender. Combined with the features like whistle steam and legacy railsounds it would be a great choice to bring to the O scale market! Lionel has been good to the New Haven fans recently and hope that continues!
Interesting thread. Yes, Lionel purchased Electric RR in its entirety, Technology, Patents, and Dr ZW too! A very vibrant time at Lionel in those years, when I joined (2005); with Lou Kovach and Neil young heading the Legacy Charge! Loved the Videos with Clyde, Magneta, and the "System". My participation in the Legacy development was a once in a lifetime event to experience. Legacy forever changed the landscape of train control, and everything since has been limited to incremental improvements. Lionel had originally planned a Legacy upgrade business, however, time did not permit my development of the code to include into the Cruise Commander, etc. There was an R4LC upgrade part, but it never was offered for sale. It was intended to replace the R4LC and run TMCC locos in Legacy mode. Lou demo'd the upgrade in a trade show (I think in Chicago?), A busy time for sure, with Legacy, then Vision, and building up teams to meet the aggressive schedules...
Good 'ol Days!
@p51 posted:Hey, everything exists in HO scale and there's a lot of stuff you'd assume to already be in O but has never been (and maybe never will).
If I had a nickel for each time I saw something in HO and wished it was also in O, Bill Gates would be shining my shoes right now.
Hi p51 - True:
Here is the HO version. Notice the Destination Board says: “Pontiac” - Pontiac is about ten miles from my train room. Like to ride my bicycle in the summer to check out the trains.
Hope to see you out rail-fanning: Gary 🚂
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@trainroomgary posted:Hi p51 - True:
Here is the HO version. Notice the Destination Board says: “Pontiac” - Pontiac is about ten miles from my train room. Like to ride my bicycle in the summer to check out the trains.
Gary, I live around 10 miles from the BNSF/UP/Amtrak mainline between Vancouver BC (Canada) and LA. The Amtrak Cascade trains have these Chargers and I've seen several HO scale models of them at hobby shops.
I've talked with a couple of Amtrak engineers who hate running these units. They give the same alarm for everything, requiring them to look away from the front end. I've also been told the suspension bottoms out below the height of the tops of rails. On bumpy tracks, the pilot on one could dig into grade crossings.
There's Amtrak 1402, the Charger which took a ride down the embankment at Dupont, WA in the fatal '501 crash' from 5 years ago. I wouldn't imagine anyone would want to make a model of that one. I caught that unit originally being delivered to Seattle for service in this photo.
It's all moot, as I model the 1940s, so nothing like this would be anything I could use.
i wonder if lionel still has that chonky oversized dash 9 tooling like what was used for SP 8228 and the GE demo unit
i would like to see it come back with lionchief plus 2.0 and also the old 90s era SD60M and SD50 models too
A bump and go trolley that can run on fixed voltage. 
Alright I’ll jump in…how about a chop nose GP9? Something a little different.
Honestly, with all of the custom runs and some lucky finds in the 2nd hand market, my wish list of stuff is getting low. Possibly a blue comet rerun? That’s overdue.
It’ll be interesting to see what Mth tooling they roll out. We haven’t seen a unique electric in a while and Mth had tooling for some good ones.
Legacy version of the Warhorse Hudson, from the VL Hudson tooling but with disc drivers.
Also, an unlettered option.
Dave
there's a workbench wednesday tonight i wonder if Ryan will tease any catalog stuff
me on the 12th be like-
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a clear diesel with LEDs all inside of it
I think I had said in one of the other catalog drop topics from a few years back, a Pennsy Torpedo. I know that there have been some other manufacturers that have done this, and I believe done well. It would be interesting to see them do one. Granted, I think it may be a bit before they would do this with the load of Pennsy K4's that have popped out in recent years. Maybe just down the road, what do you all think?
@SantaFeFan posted:Interesting thread. Yes, Lionel purchased Electric RR in its entirety, Technology, Patents, and Dr ZW too! A very vibrant time at Lionel in those years, when I joined (2005); with Lou Kovach and Neil young heading the Legacy Charge! Loved the Videos with Clyde, Magneta, and the "System". My participation in the Legacy development was a once in a lifetime event to experience. Legacy forever changed the landscape of train control, and everything since has been limited to incremental improvements. Lionel had originally planned a Legacy upgrade business, however, time did not permit my development of the code to include into the Cruise Commander, etc. There was an R4LC upgrade part, but it never was offered for sale. It was intended to replace the R4LC and run TMCC locos in Legacy mode. Lou demo'd the upgrade in a trade show (I think in Chicago?), A busy time for sure, with Legacy, then Vision, and building up teams to meet the aggressive schedules...
Good 'ol Days!
I'd sure love to see them spit out a Legacy Upgrade kit, that would be really great!
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I'd sure love to see them spit out a Legacy Upgrade kit, that would be really great!
It sounds like "they "were working on it, and "they" probably would have.
Unfortunately, " they "aren't there anymore.
@RickO posted:It sounds like "they "were working on it, and "they" probably would have.
Unfortunately, " they "aren't there anymore.
Well, somebody is there doing development! That's the they I'd like to see work on it. 
@gunrunnerjohn posted:Well, somebody is there doing development! That's the they I'd like to see work on it.
I don't think "they're" interested John.😆
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:I think I had said in one of the other catalog drop topics from a few years back, a Pennsy Torpedo. I know that there have been some other manufacturers that have done this, and I believe done well. It would be interesting to see them do one. Granted, I think it may be a bit before they would do this with the load of Pennsy K4's that have popped out in recent years. Maybe just down the road, what do you all think?
i like this idea as a lionchief plus 2.0 engine i could possibly go for
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:I think I had said in one of the other catalog drop topics from a few years back, a Pennsy Torpedo. I know that there have been some other manufacturers that have done this, and I believe done well. It would be interesting to see them do one. Granted, I think it may be a bit before they would do this with the load of Pennsy K4's that have popped out in recent years. Maybe just down the road, what do you all think?
I’m not interested in anymore K4s unless they fix that gearbox.
@rplst8 posted:I’m not interested in anymore K4s unless they fix that gearbox.
If they did a torpedo the gearbox is probably a non-issue. I’d think they’d just use the Mth torpedo tooling with legacy.
@EricTrainMan posted:If they did a torpedo the gearbox is probably a non-issue. I’d think they’d just use the Mth torpedo tooling with legacy.
how much do you think it would cost ?
around 900 -1000?
No clue if I already said this in here, if not I'll just ask for forgiveness and say it again, roadrailers. Especially if they're the old K-line railmate tooling. The darn things go for like $200 on the popular auction site we all know and loathe and the only way to expand my roadrailer train without nuking my bank account has been to modify pre-existing trailers with the trucks of old plastic MPC cabeese and Legos to hold the trailers in place.
I personally would love to see more Lionmaster steam engines that have all the neat featured of scale steam engines. I think those that Lionel already produced have been mega sales hits.
And it would definitely fill the need for "scale like" engines for those of us that don't have room for layouts that employ 072/080/090 curves.
@Junior posted:I personally would love to see more Lionmaster steam engines that have all the neat featured of scale steam engines. I think those that Lionel already produced have been mega sales hits.
And it would definitely fill the need for "scale like" engines for those of us that don't have room for layouts that employ 072/080/090 curves.
Totally agree! Not sure the still do lionmaster but do the same thing under the lionchief plus 2.0 brand.
Anybody know if lionel is printing the whole catalog this time ?
i really hope they do
@Norm Charbonneau posted:Hmm. Then again, for a brief period of time they marketed ERR stuff in their catalog. Even had a Lionel p/n.
Pepperidge Farm remembers:
http://www.lionel.com/products...mmandertrade-6-elrr1
So, for at least a brief moment in time, they weren't averse to offering command control upgrades.
And I remember, too. Those were the day, my friend, we thought they'd never end...
